The Big Picture
Three conversations on The Joe Rogan Experience show working filmmakers describing how they found their way into film and what they think a film is for. Quentin Tarantino and Roger Avary describe a shared strategy from their early days: make an art film on top of a genre foundation [1]. Zack Snyder calls himself a genre filmmaker because genre lets him explore philosophy and mythology, and argues that "movies are modern myth" [2]. Mel Gibson says that at 69 what motivates him is creation, and that while he considers himself average at most things, "I know how to tell a story on film" [3].
The passages also show how much of the craft is learned outside a classroom and outside the system. Avary quit his job as a production assistant on the spot after being told to simply call himself a director [1]. Snyder spent about ten years directing and shooting commercials before his first film [2]. Gibson self-funded The Passion of the Christ, and every major studio declined to distribute it [3].
Where the Experts Agree
- Genre is a base to build on, not a ceiling. Avary points to Blood Simple as the model and says Kubrick made genre films in every category, from science fiction to horror to costume drama; he wanted to "keep one foot in exploitation" while elevating the material [1]. Snyder's goal on Dawn of the Dead became a self-aware B movie, deconstructing the genre [2].
- Film can carry more than its plot. Snyder compares superheroes to the gods ancient people invented to explain erupting volcanoes: Superman is a 20th-century answer to feeling helpless before war and class struggle, and Batman is a myth for the urban jungle [2]. Gibson believes image and art can convey things emotionally and spiritually without being overt, and cites the opening shot of Ridley Scott's Gladiator, a hand brushing over wheat, as something that works without anyone quite knowing why [3].
- Nerve matters. Langley told Avary, start at the top it's the best way to go [1]. Cinematographer Matt Leonetti told a budget-anxious Snyder to stop worrying and make it cool, or it would be just another forgettable zombie movie, and Snyder credits that with the film's edge [2]. Gibson self-funded The Passion expecting perhaps to break even [3].
- Other people open doors. Killing Zoe began when producer Lawrence Bender found a cheap bank location while scouting Reservoir Dogs and asked if anyone had a bank script; Avary said yes and then wrote one [1]. After the studios passed, a tiny company, Newmarket, took on Gibson's film, and he made handshake deals with exhibitors [3].
Where They Differ
The three passages largely agree; what differs is the road each filmmaker took and what each reaches for.
- Declaring it versus earning it. Avary admits "I was a poser I was faking it until I made it," but says that telling people what he was eventually made it true [1]. Snyder describes the opposite route: he calls his decade of commercials his 10,000 hours, and says that by his first film nothing on set was unfamiliar [2].
- Self-awareness versus sincerity. Snyder aimed for a self-aware B movie that deconstructs its genre [2]. Gibson, raised Catholic and fully believing, says The Passion was an honor to make, and talks about conveying things emotionally and spiritually [3].
- Myth versus history. Snyder treats films as modern myth [2]. Gibson recalls dreaming at 17 of a Viking film in Old Norse, an early sign of his drive to depict history in its own languages [3].
- Inside the system or around it. Avary's bank film grew out of a producer's location scouting for another production [1]. Gibson's film met fierce opposition, and he says Rupert Murdoch was advised he'd be out of business in five years if he distributed it; it became a phenomenal success that bypassed the system [3]. Rogan argues in that conversation that secular Hollywood treats Christianity as the one religion it is acceptable to disparage [3].
Practical Takeaways
- Make an art film on top of a genre foundation, as Tarantino and Avary describe doing [1].
- Study filmmakers who worked across genres; Avary names Blood Simple and Kubrick as his reference points [1].
- Say what you are. Avary says telling people he was a director eventually made it true [1].
- Say yes to an opening and then do the work: Avary claimed to have a bank script and then wrote one [1].
- Put in the hours wherever you can get them. Snyder's ten years of commercials meant nothing on his first film set was unfamiliar [2].
- When budget worry takes over, remember Leonetti's advice to Snyder: stop worrying and make it cool [2].
- Trust images to carry feeling without explanation, as Gibson says of the hand brushing over wheat in Gladiator [3].
- If the usual gatekeepers decline, look for another route: Gibson funded his film himself and dealt with exhibitors directly [3].
Sources
- 2240 - Roger Avary & Quentin Tarantino · The Joe Rogan Experience
- Zack Snyder on Making 300 and Watchmen, Director's Cuts, Rebel Moon and Superheroes as Modern Myth · The Joe Rogan Experience
- Mel Gibson · The Joe Rogan Experience
